BimmerFest BMW Forum banner
1 - 20 of 65 Posts

·
Officially a BMW Homer.
Joined
·
1,037 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Living in NYC, getting rid of the Bridgestone's RFT (18's) was only a matter of time. I bought a set of Goodyear Eagle F1 Asymmetric's from TireRack.com last week and had them installed this past Thursday. WHAT A DIFFERENCE!!!!!

Let me start off by saying that to this day, I still can't comprehend how BMW would allow those Bridgestones RFT to pass their ride quality test and mount such a hard tire and expect good feedback. My salesman never informed me how bad these tires were going to be for commuting in NYC. I told him the roads in my area were not good, he said: 'just drive with caution & I should be fine'. Huge Understatement. Unless you live in a town where the roads are damn near perfect, you will or have already hit a bump or a pothole where the end result is a vicious, vibrating impact that leaves you looking at your rear view mirror to see if any car parts were left behind. My Girlfriend was with me on the night I Purchased my car back in July, We hit a bump that was no taller than 3-4 inches off the ground at about 35 miles an hour, the impact was so bad that I was actually embarrased when she turned to me after cathching her breath and said..."This is a BMW, that's not suppose to happen". This is the last thing I want to hear the night of just commiting to 50 Grand.

With that said.. in comes the Asymmetric's =-) When I drove off from the tire shop Just freshly mounted, I Immediately encountered a rough road. No Surprise, its the Bronx! As I was purposely driving through the rough terrain, knowing that my tires didn't even have a mile on them yet, It almost felt as if I was missing the bumps- Because there was no noticable Impact. It was that much of a difference that I was literally second guessing myself. it absorbs bumps a 110% better than the Bridgestones for the obvious reasons. The suspension on the car is still somewhat stiff but that is expected and manageable, However now I can drive with my eyes straight ahead instead of staring down on the road dodging and swirling around bumps like a lunatic. Its almost as if at one point, those Bridgestone's lowered my overall expection of the car.

I paid about 800$ shipped for the set from Tire Rack. There's a 50 dollar rebate that I should get in the mail. I believe when I first got quoted for the set back in August, it was closer to $900. They are cheaper than the Michilens PS2's and get about the same great reviews on multiple websites in terms of quietness, Handling and grip.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
327 Posts
You are going to run summers tires all winter in NYC? Or you have a set of winters? Also please give us a review on the goodyears handling aspects. Thanks
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,585 Posts
My Michelin RFT's never really bothered me................however, a tire guy told me that is because I don't know the difference and if I changed to a regular tire the ride would be noticeably improved. Congrats on the change and I'm glad that your ride is improved.
 

·
Officially a BMW Homer.
Joined
·
1,037 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I Have another car that I will be using for snow conditions, so yes, summer tires it is =-) Even if I was presented with that dilemma under different circumstances, NYC usually does a decent job with cleaning the roads. If I lived upstate where they get a lot more snow then us, than maybe I'd consider it. I can see myself not taking out the car while its snowing anyway, its too dangrous not having X drive and I wouldn't like salt on my car ;) I rather have the performance of summer tires than having all season tires all year around. Summer Tires are softer too and that was my priority when changing my set, to get a smoother ride.

In terms of Handling, the cornering is as good, if not Better than that of the Bridgestone's- I will need more time to evaulate this. In dry & mild weather, I thought the Bridgestone's did a pretty solid job in terms of Handling. In the Rain however, they were slippery. Also, as the weather got colder I noticed the RFT's got much much harder. I have not had the opportunity to test out the Goodyear's in the rain yet as it has been pretty dry in NY lately.
 

·
Officially a BMW Homer.
Joined
·
1,037 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
My Michelin RFT's never really bothered me................however, a tire guy told me that is because I don't know the difference and if I changed to a regular tire the ride would be noticeably improved. Congrats on the change and I'm glad that your ride is improved.
Did your 2008 E92 come with Michelins RFT's? I thought That was new only for 09 models. I had a late built 08 (MFG in June)from Germany. It is possible that you could have softer walls and better overall tires then those of the Bridgestone's Fred Flingstone stone tires.

Also, as Captain Audio has pointed out on several occasions, Location of where you usually commute is key. The Bridgestone's weren't bad when riding on smooth Pavement.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
443 Posts
OP: I still have my crappy RFT on my car too. Now I heard that dumping the RFT and getting regular tires makes the handling of the car inferior to what it was becuase RFT have thicker side walls that make the car more stable. Can you comment on this?
 

·
Corner Carving Addict
Joined
·
3,276 Posts
My Michelin RFT's never really bothered me................however, a tire guy told me that is because I don't know the difference and if I changed to a regular tire the ride would be noticeably improved. Congrats on the change and I'm glad that your ride is improved.
+1

No real problems with my Michelins. But then again the roads around here are decently maintained. I will say that occasionally with the Michelin RFTs I notice losing grip on uneven pavement.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
111 Posts
I have the Continental RFT's and so far they have provided a smooth ride. I don't think that even though the roads around my parts are great, they are better than the OP's from previous experience during travels to the east.
 

·
Worlds Foremost Authority
Joined
·
15,956 Posts
OP: I still have my crappy RFT on my car too. Now I heard that dumping the RFT and getting regular tires makes the handling of the car inferior to what it was becuase RFT have thicker side walls that make the car more stable. Can you comment on this?
That is not true,

The car handles better without the RFTs, particularly on rough surfaces because the RFTs bounce all over the place and it is very difficult to manage the contact patches. On a bumpy curve the RFTs are downright scary as the tires loose contact and

I replaced my RFTs with Pirelli P_Zero Nero M&S non RFTs. I have had the car on the Autocross Course at Lime Rock and I and my friend Travis who is a champion autocross driver felt that the car handled better without the Bridgestones.

CA
 

·
Petrolhead
Joined
·
340 Posts
That is not true,

The car handles better without the RFTs, particularly on rough surfaces because the RFTs bounce all over the place and it is very difficult to manage the contact patches.

I replaced my RFTs with Pirelli P_Zero Nero M&S non RFTs. I have had the car on the Autocross Course at Lime Rock and both me and my friend Travis who is a champion autocross driver felt that the car handled better without the Bridgestones.

CA
I was thinking about getting the Pirelli's for my Z4. How are they?
 

·
Worlds Foremost Authority
Joined
·
15,956 Posts
I was thinking about getting the Pirelli's for my Z4. How are they?
They are smooth, quiet and predictable. The are all seasons but balanced more toward Summer than Winter driving. I don't think they would be all that geat in anything other than light snow but I don't have any experience to confirm that.

CA
 

·
Worlds Foremost Authority
Joined
·
15,956 Posts
Living in NYC, getting rid of the Bridgestone's RFT (18's) was only a matter of time. I bought a set of Goodyear Eagle F1 Asymmetric's from TireRack.com last week and had them installed this past Thursday. WHAT A DIFFERENCE!!!!!

Let me start off by saying that to this day, I still can't comprehend how BMW would allow those Bridgestones RFT to pass their ride quality test and mount such a hard tire and expect good feedback. My salesman never informed me how bad these tires were going to be for commuting in NYC. I told him the roads in my area were not good, he said: 'just drive with caution & I should be fine'. Huge Understatement. Unless you live in a town where the roads are damn near perfect, you will or have already hit a bump or a pothole where the end result is a vicious, vibrating impact that leaves you looking at your rear view mirror to see if any car parts were left behind. My Girlfriend was with me on the night I Purchased my car back in July, We hit a bump that was no taller than 3-4 inches off the ground at about 35 miles an hour, the impact was so bad that I was actually embarrased when she turned to me after cathching her breath and said..."This is a BMW, that's not suppose to happen". This is the last thing I want to hear the night of just commiting to 50 Grand.

With that said.. in comes the Asymmetric's =-) When I drove off from the tire shop Just freshly mounted, I Immediately encountered a rough road. No Surprise, its the Bronx! As I was purposely driving through the rough terrain, knowing that my tires didn't even have a mile on them yet, It almost felt as if I was missing the bumps- Because there was no noticable Impact. It was that much of a difference that I was literally second guessing myself. it absorbs bumps a 110% better than the Bridgestones for the obvious reasons. The suspension on the car is still somewhat stiff but that is expected and manageable, However now I can drive with my eyes straight ahead instead of staring down on the road dodging and swirling around bumps like a lunatic. Its almost as if at one point, those Bridgestone's lowered my overall expection of the car.

I paid about 800$ shipped for the set from Tire Rack. There's a 50 dollar rebate that I should get in the mail. I believe when I first got quoted for the set back in August, it was closer to $900. They are cheaper than the Michilens PS2's and get about the same great reviews on multiple websites in terms of quietness, Handling and grip.
Gino's experience exactly parallels mine. BMWs choice of the RFTs is just bad engineering and is inexcusable. If you have not driven a wport package 335i with RFTs in New York you will not understand what Gino is talking about but as a fello NYC resident I can vouch for the accuracy of his post.

CA
 

·
Flying monkey herder
Joined
·
8,177 Posts
FYI, your summer tires ARE dangerous, even when its not snowing. grip is substantially reduced when the temps are below 40F. forget about wet and cold, even if its not snow.

summer compound gets hockey puck slick and hard when cold. an all season tire will have much more grip under these conditions.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,138 Posts
Gino's experience exactly parallels mine. BMWs choice of the RFTs is just bad engineering and is inexcusable. If you have not driven a wport package 335i with RFTs in New York you will not understand what Gino is talking about but as a fello NYC resident I can vouch for the accuracy of his post.

CA
I am not a fellow NY'er but I live in CT and travel into the city often -- so I know what you are talking about although don't feel the pain on a daily basis.

However, this statement is stupid "BMWs choice of the RFTs is just bad engineering and is inexcusable"

These are world cars....they are not specifically designed for NYC alone. Having spent two weeks in Germany in October....these cars are designed and made to handle EU roads vs. pot marked NYC roads.

The only "poor decision" is "NOT" offering people a choice so that they can suite the car for the region of the country they most drive in.

It is a simple matter of offering a "CHOICE". There are many on here who will give you LOTS of reasons for advantages of RFT including past stories of stranded pregnant wives or being able to make an important flight because of RFT or the ED adventure someone had traveling almost 1200miles on a punctured tire with regular air fill-up till they could make it back to Germany to a BMW dealer.

And then, you have the stories of those like NYC and being stranded in PA for days waiting for a tire.

The simple fix is "OFFER A CHOICE". BMW NA should strike a deal with TireRack.com. If the customer chooses non-RFT, then the local dealer swaps tires with TireRack. This puts RFT in circulation for those that want them and those that don't get non-RFTs....and then everyone is happy!

So, it was not "bad engineering " vs bad marketing. The car does EXACTLY what it is suppose to do -- just not for your liking on NYC pot hole infested streets.
 

·
Worlds Foremost Authority
Joined
·
15,956 Posts
I am not a fellow NY'er but I live in CT and travel into the city often -- so I know what you are talking about although don't feel the pain on a daily basis.

However, this statement is stupid "BMWs choice of the RFTs is just bad engineering and is inexcusable"

These are world cars....they are not specifically designed for NYC alone. Having spent two weeks in Germany in October....these cars are designed and made to handle EU roads vs. pot marked NYC roads.

The only "poor decision" is "NOT" offering people a choice so that they can suite the car for the region of the country they most drive in.

It is a simple matter of offering a "CHOICE". There are many on here who will give you LOTS of reasons for advantages of RFT including past stories of stranded pregnant wives or being able to make an important flight because of RFT or the ED adventure someone had traveling almost 1200miles on a punctured tire with regular air fill-up till they could make it back to Germany to a BMW dealer.

And then, you have the stories of those like NYC and being stranded in PA for days waiting for a tire.

The simple fix is "OFFER A CHOICE". BMW NA should strike a deal with TireRack.com. If the customer chooses non-RFT, then the local dealer swaps tires with TireRack. This puts RFT in circulation for those that want them and those that don't get non-RFTs....and then everyone is happy!

So, it was not "bad engineering " vs bad marketing. The car does EXACTLY what it is suppose to do -- just not for your liking on NYC pot hole infested streets.
Handling and ride quality are not mutually exclusive.
I stand by my "Bad Engineering" statement. If a car is purchased in New York City it is reasonable to expect that it will be drivable in New York City. And New York City is not the only place that has bad roads as can be witnessed by posts here from Chicago, San Francisco, Boston, etc.

As much as I hated the RFTs I had mixed feelings about replacing them because of the fact that there was no room in the car for a spare. This of course is a further example of Superior German Engineering.

And I am not the only one who feels that way as evidenced by the OP's statment " I still can't comprehend how BMW would allow those Bridgestones RFT to pass their ride quality test and mount such a hard tire"
.
 

·
Officially a BMW Homer.
Joined
·
1,037 Posts
Discussion Starter · #16 · (Edited)
However, this statement is stupid "BMWs choice of the RFTs is just bad engineering and is inexcusable"

These are world cars....they are not specifically designed for NYC alone. Having spent two weeks in Germany in October....these cars are designed and made to handle EU roads vs. pot marked NYC roads.

The only "poor decision" is "NOT" offering people a choice so that they can suite the car for the region of the country they most drive in.So, it was not "bad engineering " vs bad marketing. The car does EXACTLY what it is suppose to do -- just not for your liking on NYC pot hole infested streets.
I agree with you on some counts, except that, I don't think some people care about how sensitive their Bridgestone RFT's are to just about everything but a smooth pavement. Or Maybe its just that my expectations are too high for a Low Pro tire. Maybe other people's commute is that much smoother or maybe I just got a different, harder sets of Potenza's- I don't know anymore. I do know is that I have rode on some Low Pro tires in the past non RFT and the ride was never this bad. For me I already knew within weeks of owning the car that I couldn't deal with that vicious 'Bang' anymore that literally made me embarrassed if other people were in the car with me to witness. Even when not in NYC.

I took a 180 mile trip (roundtrip) to a shooting range in PA early October. I hit at least 5-6 "spots" on the road that made the car feel like it ran over a school yard speed bump doing 75 mph. That to me is unacceptable. That is only my Opinion though. Maybe it could be acceptable to others, but to me and the girlfriend, its not. For it to be a BMW even with Sports package 18's, I expect a less 'violent' ride because it is indeed a BMW. Not the ride of a 5 series, but better than this. I do have a much better ride now but that's $800 later. And that is after shopping around and doing some research. How bout BMW gives me a choice in RFT or not when ordering up my car that could of put those 800bucks on another option.
See, That's what runs these Forums sometime.. to get an opportunity to vent here n there and see if anyone else shares the same voice as you and maybe even :beerchug: from such similarities that your wife or your good pal who drives a Van will never be able to relate to.

BMW should at least come with better equip RFT than the one we're discussing if they plan to stay with the 'RFT on everything they make' MOJO. (Which is why the made moves after 2 years in switching to Michelins, ding ding! Bridgestone's was not perfect after all). I personally only know of Potenza's, so I can only complain about that model.
Hey, if I'm going to get stuck with RFT by factory default, then give me a tire that cost 500 dollars a pop but thats F'in awesome! Where I can at least tell myself 'I wouldn't know I was riding on RFT's if I'd hit a pothole the size of a football.' Maybe then I'll take into account how much more convinent and safer RFTs truly are.
 

·
Worlds Foremost Authority
Joined
·
15,956 Posts
Maybe then I'll take into account how much more convinent and safer RFTs truly are.
Convenient? Perhaps. Safer? Maybe from the "can't get stranded" perspective, but a tire that should not be driven in trmperatures below 40 degrees because the tread becomes hard and looses a significant amount of grip does not fit my definition of safe. Also a tire that bounces around on bumpy roads and can't keep in contact with the road surface does not fit my definition of safe. These cars are designed as road cars. They are not race cars. When I was shopping for the car in New York and New Jersey no one said "Oh, by the way you will have to purchase a set of dedicated snow tires, even if you never drive in the snow, because the OE tires are dangerous at temperatures below 40 degrees.

CA

CA
 

·
Worlds Foremost Authority
Joined
·
15,956 Posts
:rofl: "run-craps"

:thumbup:
I forgot how to do that little copyright symbol.
Where's BJ when we need him.

Oh, here it is!

Run Craps©
MINE!

CA
 

·
Officially a BMW Homer.
Joined
·
1,037 Posts
Discussion Starter · #20 ·
FYI, your summer tires ARE dangerous, even when its not snowing. grip is substantially reduced when the temps are below 40F. forget about wet and cold, even if its not snow.

summer compound gets hockey puck slick and hard when cold. an all season tire will have much more grip under these conditions.
Your correct. Except that its been about as low as 30degrees here the past few nights and I haven't noticed a slight loss in grip whatsoever. If anything I feel the car 'Hugs' the corner a bit better. I went with GoodYear Asymmetrics because if you look them up, they along with Michelins PS2's are one of the best =-) and I'm telling you in less than a week, I can stand by it 100percent.
 
1 - 20 of 65 Posts
Top