Bimmerfest BMW banner

221 - 240 of 310 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,007 Posts
After having driven the Tesla Model 3 for 6 weeks, the car is particularly impressive in terms of how incredibly well AutoPilot works. My commute involves driving 10 miles on the Eisenhower Expressway in Chicago. Even with reduced traffic due to Covid 19 the traffic is best described as heavy. Autopilot works unbelievably well compared to BMW's systems. Even with faint lane striping the Model 3 stays in the middle of its lane and does not wander off. Autopilots collision avoidance is absolutely superb and makes a Model 3 very safe. When turning off onto an off ramp the car knows to slow down automatically whether or not you tell it to. My commute is much less tiring than what it used to be. If one lives an urban area with robust rush hour traffic, the Tesla Model 3 excels in that environment.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,256 Posts
After having driven the Tesla Model 3 for 6 weeks, the car is particularly impressive in terms of how incredibly well AutoPilot works. My commute involves driving 10 miles on the Eisenhower Expressway in Chicago. Even with reduced traffic due to Covid 19 the traffic is best described as heavy. Autopilot works unbelievably well compared to BMW's systems. Even with faint lane striping the Model 3 stays in the middle of its lane and does not wander off. Autopilots collision avoidance is absolutely superb and makes a Model 3 very safe. When turning off onto an off ramp the car knows to slow down automatically whether or not you tell it to. My commute is much less tiring than what it used to be. If one lives an urban area with robust rush hour traffic, the Tesla Model 3 excels in that environment.
Pharding, what's your sense of the suspension setup, and the firmness overall? I've only been able to drive the Performance model. No LR-AWD models have been available for test drives in my area.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
524 Posts
Pharding, what's your sense of the suspension setup, and the firmness overall? I've only been able to drive the Performance model. No LR-AWD models have been available for test drives in my area.
How did you like it Robert? I don’t think the Model 3 feels as planted as the 5 Series, but Model S does. Interior is definitely more spartan, but still good though.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,581 Posts
After having driven the Tesla Model 3 for 6 weeks, the car is particularly impressive in terms of how incredibly well AutoPilot works. My commute involves driving 10 miles on the Eisenhower Expressway in Chicago. Even with reduced traffic due to Covid 19 the traffic is best described as heavy. Autopilot works unbelievably well compared to BMW's systems. Even with faint lane striping the Model 3 stays in the middle of its lane and does not wander off. Autopilots collision avoidance is absolutely superb and makes a Model 3 very safe. When turning off onto an off ramp the car knows to slow down automatically whether or not you tell it to. My commute is much less tiring than what it used to be. If one lives an urban area with robust rush hour traffic, the Tesla Model 3 excels in that environment.
My question would be why anyone would trust any technology to pick up "faint lane striping" especially in bad weather, heavy traffic, etc. nor do I understand why limited or any AutoPilot is desirable as a paid-for commonly used accessory. How to tell a car is "very safe" by driving it for 6 weeks is another one. Our society doesn't even tolerate 1/1000 chance of death from any new drug on the market, it will only tolerate new tech with overall statistics, so we shall find out which type of tolerance occurs in the long run. Eventually this technology will lead to mandatory speed limits and centralized complete surveillance. My daughter's new 2020 Mazda 3 doesn't track you like other cars, and it has plenty of environmental credits, with full safety systems included.
 

·
Registered
2020 BMW 530e xDrive
Joined
·
477 Posts
My question would be why anyone would trust any technology to pick up "faint lane striping" especially in bad weather, heavy traffic, etc. nor do I understand why limited or any AutoPilot is desirable as a paid-for commonly used accessory. How to tell a car is "very safe" by driving it for 6 weeks is another one. Our society doesn't even tolerate 1/1000 chance of death from any new drug on the market, it will only tolerate new tech with overall statistics, so we shall find out which type of tolerance occurs in the long run. Eventually this technology will lead to mandatory speed limits and centralized complete surveillance. My daughter's new 2020 Mazda 3 doesn't track you like other cars, and it has plenty of environmental credits, with full safety systems included.
I agree. Tesla, like all of these systems, are still just driver aids and not driver replacements. Except Tesla marketing and etc can give you over confidence to see it as more than such. It works great until it doesn't. Then your crash is "training the algorithm"... And it has lead to some high profile crashes and deaths and the sad videos of seeing people sleeping and watching movies in their cars.

https://www.consumerreports.org/autonomous-driving/tesla-navigate-on-autopilot-automatic-lane-change-requires-significant-driver-intervention/

BMW system works great for me to reduce fatigue, but doesn't lull me into a false sense that the car is driving me.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,581 Posts
I agree. Tesla, like all of these systems, are still just driver aids and not driver replacements. Except Tesla marketing and etc can give you over confidence to see it as more than such. It works great until it doesn't. Then your crash is "training the algorithm"... And it has lead to some high profile crashes and deaths and the sad videos of seeing people sleeping and watching movies in their cars.

https://www.consumerreports.org/autonomous-driving/tesla-navigate-on-autopilot-automatic-lane-change-requires-significant-driver-intervention/

BMW system works great for me to reduce fatigue, but doesn't lull me into a false sense that the car is driving me.
A friend had a chance to sample an advanced self-driving car and he said it was like driving with a teenager's first time on the road. I'm sure newer systems are going to be better but don't believe millions of years of evolving human movement is going to be replicated any time soon by AI/IT.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,007 Posts
Pharding, what's your sense of the suspension setup, and the firmness overall? I've only been able to drive the Performance model. No LR-AWD models have been available for test drives in my area.
Before turning in my 540iX M Sport, I drove them back to back. The 5er with the M Sport Sport Suspension is slightly more planted at speed. It feels very controlled. The Tesla Model 3 slightly less so, but it is still fine. The Tesla steering is noticeably better than the BMW 540ix M-Sport. That was rather surprising to me.

I have had the Tesla for 7 weeks and I spent a total $6.50 for electricity. I charge up each day for free at a City of Chicago garage literally right next to my office building.

Last weekend I was surprised to learn that in very cold weather there battery loses 40% of its range. That is a lot.

Autopilot drives more perfectly than a human can drive.
 

·
Registered
2020 BMW 530e xDrive
Joined
·
477 Posts
Before turning in my 540iX M Sport, I drove them back to back. The 5er with the M Sport Sport Suspension is slightly more planted at speed. It feels very controlled. The Tesla Model 3 slightly less so, but it is still fine. The Tesla steering is noticeably better than the BMW 540ix M-Sport. That was rather surprising to me.

I have had the Tesla for 7 weeks and I spent a total $6.50 for electricity. I charge up each day for free at a City of Chicago garage literally right next to my office building.

Last weekend I was surprised to learn that in very cold weather there battery loses 40% of its range. That is a lot.

Autopilot drives more perfectly than a human can drive.
Is that a 40% loss at the start or a 40% loss over the course of the drive? Where I am going is if this is a 40% loss at the start you'll lose even more once climate control is turned on during your drive.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,256 Posts
Before turning in my 540iX M Sport, I drove them back to back. The 5er with the M Sport Sport Suspension is slightly more planted at speed. It feels very controlled. The Tesla Model 3 slightly less so, but it is still fine. The Tesla steering is noticeably better than the BMW 540ix M-Sport. That was rather surprising to me.

I have had the Tesla for 7 weeks and I spent a total $6.50 for electricity. I charge up each day for free at a City of Chicago garage literally right next to my office building.

Last weekend I was surprised to learn that in very cold weather there battery loses 40% of its range. That is a lot.

Autopilot drives more perfectly than a human can drive.
So you're coming from "704" in the G20 to the Tesla standard suspension? Is there much "tilt" or "float", or does the Tesla feel tight and dialed in on fast curves?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,581 Posts
So you're coming from "704" in the G20 to the Tesla standard suspension? Is there much "tilt" or "float", or does the Tesla feel tight and dialed in on fast curves?
I don't believe the AWD version can actually have a "704" suspension, only the RWD versions with the M package. The 5-er is a G30.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
524 Posts
Before turning in my 540iX M Sport, I drove them back to back. The 5er with the M Sport Sport Suspension is slightly more planted at speed. It feels very controlled. The Tesla Model 3 slightly less so, but it is still fine. The Tesla steering is noticeably better than the BMW 540ix M-Sport. That was rather surprising to me.

I have had the Tesla for 7 weeks and I spent a total $6.50 for electricity. I charge up each day for free at a City of Chicago garage literally right next to my office building.

Last weekend I was surprised to learn that in very cold weather there battery loses 40% of its range. That is a lot.

Autopilot drives more perfectly than a human can drive.
Wow - 40% is a lot. Would not have expected that. That is a really big negative in cold weather climates like ours then. Wish they would improve on that.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,007 Posts
I don't believe the AWD version can actually have a "704" suspension, only the RWD versions with the M package. The 5-er is a G30.
My 2017 540iX M-Sport definitely had the 704 passive M-Sport suspension.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,007 Posts
So you're coming from "704" in the G20 to the Tesla standard suspension? Is there much "tilt" or "float", or does the Tesla feel tight and dialed in on fast curves?
The Tesla Model 3 in comparison to my G30 540iX M-Sport with the 704 suspension feels tight and dialed on curves with no noticeable tilt or float. Model 3 feels quite sporty. However I would never say that is an equal to my 540ix M-Sport, but it is close. My 2017 540iX had the sport seats which are awesome. They really hold you in when you take curves at speed and they adjustable. When taking curves at speed in my Tesla Model 3 Long Range AWD, you can slide to a modest degree requiring that you brace yourself against the door or center console.

With a Battery Electric Vehicle range is an important consideration. You only charge it to maximum battery capacity for long road trips. For daily driving you charge it to 80 to 90 percent of maximum capacity. With routine daily driving you get 20 to 30 percent than the ideal highway mileage. That is true of any BEV.

Like I said earlier autopilot works unbelievably well. In highway urban rush hour traffic it is quite enjoyable and quite relaxing.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,581 Posts
I guess many of us already know about this, but it has much to do with choosing other brands over Tesla, which ranks lowest in initial quality: [link to JD Power article on CNET not allowed???]

Seems like overall quality of new cars is worse compared to past rates hovering around 100 problems per 100 vehicles at the top.

Try this: cnet.com/roadshow/news/tesla-jd-power-initial-quality-study-ev-rank/
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
43 Posts
Since I'm not a Tesla owner, I have no idea whether their quality is better or worse than other brands. I do know that expectations play a large part in the JD Power quality survey results. I find it hard to believe that Dodge is the highest quality brand, followed by Kia.

Most of the luxury brands are below the median value. Tesla is right down there with MB, Porsche, Acura, Volvo, Land Rover and Audi. It's a matter of expectations. Luxury car buyers are demanding (the kindest word that I could use) and expect a perfect car. Someone buying a Kia's idea of a perfect car is probably not as restrictive. I think Tesla should get a temporary pass, because, the popular Model Y is brand new for 2020 and it does have fit and finish teething problems. But nothing major. I also think that Tesla's philosophy is different. They seem to expect their new owners to inspect the car carefully and then bring it in to have everything fixed. I have a feeling that this is being done on purpose, because it might be less expensive to fix cars in the field then to fail them at the end of the highly automated assembly line. I think that it's a philosophical carry over from Tesla using OTA software updates to fix electronic issues.

BMW would never do what Tesla does, but our cars do have initial issues. My 530e had more than 2.5 issues. Again, nothing major. For example, the keyless entry didn't work when it was raining. OMG, how awful (heavy sarcasm). The back up camera sometimes didn't work (fixed by a dealer installed software update). The passenger seat rattled terribly when unoccupied (still broken after two attempts).

Besides, is there really any difference between an average of 1.36 and 2.5 issues per car?
 
221 - 240 of 310 Posts
Top