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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
I am looking for people to join me in a class action lawsuit against BMW. I am about to commence an action against BMW of North America for consumer fraud.

I am referring to the ongoing problem that mostly affects 3 Series owners (MY 2001-present) who have both the harman kardon radio system and the factory navigation system. (for more background do a search here and on e46fanatics.com with the key words "fading audio" or "mono" and you will see what I am referring to)

As has been documented on this board for over a year now, there is a problem with the FM section of the H/K radio that mostly affects cars with the NAV. It involves the radio's inability to lock onto and hold a stereo signal. The symptoms are that the FM radio fades in and out of stereo repeatedly, regardless of reception area or speed of vehicle.

Although many consider a radio problem to be a minor thing, the problem is that BMW is UNABLE (or unwilling) to fix this problem!!! I had my vehicle in to the dealership (two dealerships actually) for service 5 times before it was finally admitted to me that they cannot fix the problem. This issue has been ongoing since the 2001 model year and it continues even now. It was eventually admitted to me that BMW knows about the problem but that they view it as an "operational characteristic" of the vehicle and have no intention of doing anything about it.

Now it is one thing for a car company to sell a vehicle that they know will require a trip to the dealership down the road to fix a manufacturing defect. It is quite another to sell a car that they know cannot be fixed and just tell the consumer "too bad, you bought it, now you are stuck with it" which is what BMW has done. There are laws designed to protect the public from that kind of disgraceful corporate conduct.

One of the leading law firms in the United States that specializes in class action lawsuits has agreed to take this case. They are confident that there is a viable case against BMW North America for consumer fraud. It would be helpful if we were able to locate other people who have this problem from other states to join in the litigation. It would not cost you anything to join and the possibility exists of a financial recovery from BMW.

My purpose here, however, is NOT a financial windfall. It is to remedy a disgraceful situation. BMW has been getting away with denying this problem for 3 years, yet they continue to sell cars with this problem that they can't fix. Again, my main purpose is to force BMW to own up to problem and FIX IT!!

If your car is affected by this and you are interested in joining this lawsuit, please send me an email at [email protected].

For all of us out there who have just been burning up about this, the time has come to do something about it. BMW cannot be allowed to continue this fraud without paying a price for its disgraceful conduct.

[email protected]
 

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Class action lawsuits are a good way for the attorneys to make money. I doubt if it will fix your problem, however.
 

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Rest in peace, Coach
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You should get a hold of MojoJojo too. I think he's got a beef to pick with BMW as well. :thumbup:
 

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I have both the HK and the Nav and have not experienced this problem. I only have FM reception issues when at the perimeter of a given station's broadcast radius.

If you're in New York City, radio reception is problematic by nature due to the tall buildings, especially since 9/11. Cars with conventional antennas probably do better than those with diversity antennas like our bimmers, though.

My AM reception sucks, but I don't really care about that. It could be that the diversity antenna is just lame, or my metallic window tint is interfering, or both.

Regardless, it seems like a rather trivial beef over which to start litigation, and I don't see what grounds you have for a suit. If it's really that important to you, why not try having a pro ICE installer bypass the diversity antenna and substitute a conventional antenna, or install an antenna booster, or something else of the sort?
 

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Oh, and thanks heaps for doing your part to reduce choice, clog our courts, and make our cars more expensive.
 

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You retained the leading law firm in the US that specializes in class action litigation? Which firm would that be?

gray330--you are exactly right. The "top class action firms" specialize in de minimus violations of obscure laws, such as disclosure notices for credit card companies, and then they commence a class action suit on behalf of all those "wronged" clients, few if any of which suffered any injury at all. A huge settlement ensues, and the law firm takes a big cut and distributes a few cents to each plaintiff.

And Hack, MojoJojo can't be a plaintiff since he was not wronged--he's picking other people's beefs. Free of charge!
 

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Plaz said:
If you're in New York City, radio reception is problematic by nature due to the tall buildings, especially since 9/11. Cars with conventional antennas probably do better than those with diversity antennas like our bimmers, though.
What made the reception worse after 9/11?

Mine works fine too. I there a way to join on the BMW's side in court? ;)
 

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Please, no more lawsuits, for the love of God!

It seems like a cheaper and less grief-filled solution might be to replace the head unit with an aftermarket unit for under $500?!? You can keep the BMW speakers, subwoofers and amps. And you'll probably have a better sounding system to boot!

Please, I understand your frustration, but there are far too many class-action lawsuits. Do you realize that a full 15% of the cost of the average manufactured product in the USA goes to cover the cost of product liability, principally created through class action lawsuits? So on your $40k car, you paid $6k to cover the cost of other people's class-action lawsuits.

Doesn't that make you mad?!? Please don't go and increase that $6k cost through your own suit . . .

BTW, I am not employed by BMW. I'm considering buying one. Sometimes it's not worth the fight, just enjoy your car! It's not like you or a family member got maimed or killed by the allegedly-faulty FM reception . . .
 

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As an example, here is an anouncement on a class action lawsuit against Microsoft. What did the plaintiffs receive? Vouchers!

A $1.1 billion settlement has been reached in a series of coordinated class action lawsuits alleging that Microsoft violated California's antitrust and unfair competition laws.

The settlement proceeds will be distributed to class members in the form of vouchers that may be used to buy any manufacturer's computers, any software and specified peripheral devices.

Two-thirds of any unclaimed settlement proceeds will be donated to California's most needy public schools in the form of Microsoft educational and productivity software as well as vouchers for the purchase of computer equipment, professional development services and non-Microsoft software.

Source: FindLaw.com, January 10, 2003.
 

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The HACK said:
You should get a hold of MojoJojo too. I think he's got a beef to pick with BMW as well. :thumbup:
Ha ha ha :)

I've got a complaint. I bought a new 3 series, and two cylinders were missing. It only has four! What's up with that?
 

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Named Plaintiff said:
I have retained the leading law firm in the United States that specializes in class action lawsuits.
Mutually exclusive.
 

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milski said:
What made the reception worse after 9/11?
Many (most?) NYC radio and TV stations had their transmitters located atop the towers.
 

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Discussion Starter #14 (Edited)
Plaz said:
Oh, and thanks heaps for doing your part to reduce choice, clog our courts, and make our cars more expensive.
My purpose here is not to argue with the usual crew BMW appologists who get all a quiver anytime anyone criticizes anything BMW. We all know the type. The ones who basically give BMW owners a bad rap because too much of their ego is wrapped up in what they drive.

But a word about class action law suits is in order. It is very fashionable to blame lawyers and law suits for many of the evils in the world today (when blame is more appropriately laid at the door step of the insurance companies who are the ones making obscene profits). But it probably has not occurred to you that the threat of lawsuits is one of the things that protects the public at large.

Ever hear of the Ford Pinto? For the young ones out there, the Pinto was an "economy" car that Ford produced in the1970's. It had this peculiar little defect that caused the gas tank to explode when hit from behind (even at moderately low speeds). Allegedly, Ford engineers were aware of this problem, but management decided that it would be CHEAPER to just to pay off the injured and the families of the deceased rather than re-engineer the car. This little tidbit of information came out in the class action litigation that eventually forced Ford to face this issue.

Without the threat of a massive class action, this type of behavior would go on in corporate America everyday! The tort lawyer is your last line of defense against a corporate monolith that would sacrifice your life to save a buck. Ford Explorer/Bridgestone Tire fiasco anyone?

A radio may not be an exploding gas tank, but the concept behind it is the same. A corporation knowlingly selling a defective product to which there is no fix. It is called fraud, and if you think it is better to tolerate it, your priorities are truly backward.

If you are not affected by this problem, just mind your own business. To those of us that have to put up with the BS of a car radio that is maddeningly defective and unfixable, someone (namely me) has taken an affirmative step to do something about it. It never would have come to this if BMW didn't just essentially laugh in my face and tell me "too damn bad".
 

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Named Plaintiff said:
My purpose here is not to argue with the usual crew of idiots who get all a quiver anytime anyone criticizes anything BMW. We all know the type. The ones who basically give BMW owners a bad rap because too much of their ego is wrapped up in what they drive.

But a word about class action law suits is in order. It is very fashionable to blame lawyers and law suits for many of the evils in the world today (when blame is more appropriately laid at the door step of the insurance companies who are the ones making obscene profits). But it probably has not occurred to you that the threat of lawsuits is one of the things that protects the public at large.

Ever hear of the Ford Pinto? For the young ones out there, the Pinto was an "economy" car that Ford produced in the1970's. It had this peculiar little defect that caused the gas tank to explode when hit from behind (even at moderately low speeds). Allegedly, Ford engineers were aware of this problem, but management decided that it would be CHEAPER to just to pay off the injured and the families of the deceased rather than re-engineer the car. This little tidbit of information came out in the class action litigation that eventually forced Ford to face this issue.

Without the threat of a massive class action, this type of behavior would go on in corporate America everyday! The tort lawyer is your last line of defense against a corporate monolith that would sacrifice your life to save a buck. Ford Explorer/Bridgestone Tire fiasco anyone?

A radio may not be an exploding gas tank, but the concept behind it is the same. A corporation knowlingly selling a defective product to which there is no fix. It is called fraud, and if you think it is better to tolerate it, you are a moron.

If you are not affected by this problem, just mind your own friggin business. To those of us that have to put up with the BS of a car radio that is maddeningly defective and unfixable, someone (namely me) has taken an affirmative step to do something about it. It never would have come to this if BMW didn't just essentially laugh in my face and tell me "too damn bad".
While I am not a big fan of frivolous lawsuits, and while I do think that American society today can be a little too litigious for its own good, I do feel that the OP has a reasonable point. If BMW actually is aware of the issue and chooses to not fix it, I don't see why they shouldn't be forced to own up to their (poor) choice.

Anyway, I don't know any of the facts besides what's been mentioned in this thread, but if everything is as the OP says it is, then something's amiss at BMW HQ.
 

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Named Plaintiff said:
My purpose here is not to argue with the usual crew of idiots who get all a quiver anytime anyone criticizes anything BMW. We all know the type. The ones who basically give BMW owners a bad rap because too much of their ego is wrapped up in what they drive.

But a word about class action law suits is in order. It is very fashionable to blame lawyers and law suits for many of the evils in the world today (when blame is more appropriately laid at the door step of the insurance companies who are the ones making obscene profits). But it probably has not occurred to you that the threat of lawsuits is one of the things that protects the public at large.

Ever hear of the Ford Pinto? For the young ones out there, the Pinto was an "economy" car that Ford produced in the1970's. It had this peculiar little defect that caused the gas tank to explode when hit from behind (even at moderately low speeds). Allegedly, Ford engineers were aware of this problem, but management decided that it would be CHEAPER to just to pay off the injured and the families of the deceased rather than re-engineer the car. This little tidbit of information came out in the class action litigation that eventually forced Ford to face this issue.

Without the threat of a massive class action, this type of behavior would go on in corporate America everyday! The tort lawyer is your last line of defense against a corporate monolith that would sacrifice your life to save a buck. Ford Explorer/Bridgestone Tire fiasco anyone?

A radio may not be an exploding gas tank, but the concept behind it is the same. A corporation knowlingly selling a defective product to which there is no fix. It is called fraud, and if you think it is better to tolerate it, you are a moron.

If you are not affected by this problem, just mind your own friggin business. To those of us that have to put up with the BS of a car radio that is maddeningly defective and unfixable, someone (namely me) has taken an affirmative step to do something about it. It never would have come to this if BMW didn't just essentially laugh in my face and tell me "too damn bad".
I am not an "idiot who get all a quiver anytime anyone criticizes anything BMW," your and Mojojojo's accusations notwithstanding. I simply do not see a defective product here, nor fraud.

I tried to give you some constructive feedback and some suggestions to address your issues, as well as expressing my disdain for your litigous approach to resolving a trivial problem.

If you post to a public forum, you should be prepared and willing to see the reactions of those who disagree with your approach, and not flail out calling anyone who finds your proposal distasteful and counter-productive "idiots," "morons," and telling them to "mind their own friggin business." I highly doubt this sort of reply is going to aid you in gaining sympathy or allies in your little battle.

You're correct that a slight radio reception issue is not an exploding gas tank. In fact, to equate the two as comparable grounds for a presumably large class action lawsuit is beyond absurd.
 

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Named Plaintiff said:
As has been documented on this board for over a year now, there is a problem with the FM section of the H/K radio. It involves the radio's inability to hold a stereo signal. The symptoms are that the FM radio fades in and out of stereo repeatedly, regardless of reception area or speed of vehicle.
I've never seen evidence of this being a widespread problem on this or any other board, or in my car.
 

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Dear Members,

I understand how a discussion can get heated. But on this thread we have already seen some 'heavy' wording.

Your impressions are welcome, your reactions are welcome, your opinions are welcome.

However, open hostility will not be tolerated.

We will all keep relatively civil tongues in our heads.


Thank You.
 

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Alex Baumann said:
Dear Members,

I understand how a discussion can get heated. But on this thread we have already seen some 'heavy' wording.

Your impressions are welcome, your reactions are welcome, your opinions are welcome.

However, open hostility will not be tolerated.

We will all keep relatively civil tongues in our heads.

Thank You.
My apologies. I've already edited out the more pointed items from my previous response. Dude just pushed my buttons.
 
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