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E39 (1997 - 2003)
The BMW 5-Series (E39 chassis) was introduced in the United States as a 1997 model year car and lasted until the 2004 when the E60 chassis was released. The United States saw several variations including the 525i, 528i, 530i and 540i. -- View the E39 Wiki

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  #26  
Old 10-14-2011, 09:41 AM
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bluebee bluebee is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timarnold View Post
I used 1/8" tubing ... I used a litle dab of o-ring lube
That's a great idea!

The best the auto parts stores could do for me was the too-large 5/32" ID "Windshield Washer & Vacuum Tubing" ... so I'm beginning to be convinced we need to find a MAIL ORDER supplier of a few feet of this stuff.

It seems we need:
  • About 3 feet of 1/8" ID vacuum tubing (3.5mm ID actual spec)
  • Braided seems to be preferred
  • Silicone seems to be suggested for heat resistance
The question is WHERE to get that as I did not find anything like it at the local Autozone & O'Reilly Auto Parts stores.


Quote:
Originally Posted by poolman View Post
You need to go back behind the intake on the driverside and replace the hose's back there as well.
I looked today. Not easy to see that second #4 hose without removing stuff. Nor could I see the #7 hose, which is apparently in the back of the engine.

My first thought is what has to be removed to access those hoses?

Looking in the bestlinks for SAS replacement DIYs:
- SAS (1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7)

I find Poolman suggesting a flashlight:
Quote:
Originally Posted by poolman View Post
you will need a flashlight and a mirror to see whats going on back there.
And, cn90 has photos from underneath the engine.

Is a light under the engine the best way to get access to replace those two hoses?

BTW, this post #2 says there is yet another 'large plastic" hose not pictured in the secondary air system diagram that needs replacing:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jase007 View Post
Cheap insurance to replace diverter valve (#1, #2, #8), vacuum hose to it (#4), large plastic 2nd air injection hose to/from 2nd air injection pump(not pictured) as they will prolong the life of your 2nd-ary air injection pump (proper working diaphragm in the diverter valve ensures closing to prevents hot acidic air/gases back into the SAP unit).
Is 'this' 'pressure hose that large plastic hose Jase007 was referring to?
Engine => Exhaust manifold => EMISSION CONTROL-AIR PUMP


Quote:
Originally Posted by poolman View Post
I replaced all of my small hoses with the braided type--lasts forever that stuff does.
I didn't realize this was a parts upgrade at the dealer until Doru mentioned it below.

Quote:
Originally Posted by doru View Post
Bluebee. Poolman mentioned the 3.5 x 1.8 mm hoses from the dealer, are the updated part now, with a braid around them to protect the hose from heat


Until you mentioned it, I didn't realize that was what Poolman was talking about.

From this thread, I thought Poolman bought his braided hose at O'Reilly Auto Parts:
-
E39 (1997 - 2003) > What is the Diverter Valve and how to replace it

Quote:
Originally Posted by poolman View Post
I used a heavy duty vac hose to replace the hose's back there--bought it by the foot from O'Reilly's
the hose looks like it has threads running through it and is much stronger than the OEM hose material.

It sure would be nice to see a PICTURE of that braided hose - and perhaps a part number (or description) as I couldn't find 'any' braided vacuum hose in the auto parts stores.

All I could find was this braided fuel-injection hose at O'Reillys:


Quote:
Originally Posted by doru View Post
I am not sure you need to change ALL the rubber hoses you mentioned. "Heat stroke" affected hoses are those skinny vacuum rubber lines.
Sounds like a decent plan to first replace the 3.5 mm ID x 1.8 mm thick braided vacuum hoses hoses (which is between 1/8" & 9/64" in inside diameter).

In addition, nobody seemed to have 'silicone' vacuum hose as suggested by 540 M-Sport over here:
Quote:
Originally Posted by 540 M-Sport View Post
the important attribute you need for those hoses is heat resistance...in that instance silicone hose generally works best.
For example, this is all that O'Reillys had for vacuum hose:


Q1: Would someone kindly snap a picture of the OEM updated braided hoses for the team so we can see what it looks like?

Q2: What has to be removed in order to access the SAS hoses in back of the engine (do we access them from underneath)?

Q3: Where can we get a few feet of braided, silicone, 3.5 mm ID (between 1/8" & 9/64") vacuum hose?
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Last edited by bluebee; 10-16-2011 at 09:18 PM.
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  #27  
Old 10-14-2011, 10:30 AM
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Jason5driver Jason5driver is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluebee View Post
Hmmm.... that may work ... but if the nominal prices in Realoem are any indication, it will cost three hundred dollars to replace all the vacuum hoses at Realoem prices. Double and even triple that if my experience at the Silicon Valley BMW dealerships (San Jose, Mountainview, Fremont) are any example.

Just the five tiny SAS-related hoses would cost $61 + about six dollars tax at Realoem nominal prices shown in the diagram below:
Then add $25 nominal dollars plus $2.50 tax for the two 'sucking jet pump' vacuum hoses, as shown in the diagram below:
And then add $92 plus $9 tax for the ccv-related hoses as shown in the diagram below:
Then add $56 + $5 tax for the two fuel tank breather lines (i.e., the big vacuum hose connected to the MAF-area F connector) as shown in the diagram below:
Add another $40 + $4 tax for the two fuel filter related vacuum lines (i.e., the small vacuum hose connected to the MAF-area F connector) as shown in the diagram below:
Without even adding up whatever inevitable hoses I missed ... the net is ... a whoppingly huge $300 dollars at Realoem nominal prices to replace just the vacuum hoses that I can find myself.

My three Silicon Valley BMW dealers (San Jose, Fremont, & Mountainview) typically charge twice to three times the Realoem prices ... so ... that's between five hundred and a thousand dollars just to replace the vacuum hoses that I've identified - for just the hoses!

Jason: I may have missed something big here (and it wouldn't be the first time).

Please explain:
Q: How could replacing just these hoses at these nominal prices possibly be a good deal at the BMW dealer?
I don't need the MASSIVE amount info. and links for the hoses you need.
Unless you like to post HUGE amounts of stuff that just bogs down the server and the forum...

And, I am not saying you need to replace ALL the hoses under the hood of your car.
Ridiculous.
And, if you can't afford to buy vacuum hoses for this car (E39), then you bought the WRONG car, period.
And, who actually gets prices/ price quotes from Real OEM????
Why not call, or check out a vendor's site, then price the few items you need.
Not every single rubber hose within your car...
By trying to make-shift vacuum hoses for your car, you are going to end up with MORE vacuum leaks and problems IMO.
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Last edited by Jason5driver; 10-14-2011 at 10:32 AM.
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  #28  
Old 10-16-2011, 09:53 PM
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bluebee bluebee is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason5driver View Post
I don't need the MASSIVE amount info. and links for the hoses you need.
YOU don't need it; but people who are like I am, certainly do.
  • For example, you inherently know there are vacuum caps to be ordered and replaced. I don't.
  • You inherently know exactly which scattered-about hoses to replace when lean conditions are observed. I don't.
  • You inherently know when to buy from the dealer and when to buy better parts online. I don't.
  • You inherently know when the Realoem diagrams are wrong (e.g., in the case of the L-connector versus the F-connector). I don't.
  • You inherently know what the size designations indicate in Realoem diagrams. I don't.
I don't inherently know anything about the M54, like you seem to. I have to learn it. Piece by piece. (The good news is I disseminate that learning, so that others benefit from the effort; so it's worth helping me understand.)

But, I don't think everyone inherently knows everything like you do.

Worse yet, even when they know, people's descriptions vary so greatly that, even if we actually KNEW where all E39 problematic hoses were, we'd STILL have problems identifying them for sure (both by part number, and by auto-parts-store replacement size and by engine location).

Plus, finding part numbers on realoem is problematic because they're scattered about, and, the diagrams are wrong in some cases (e.g., CCV & sucking jet pump) and downright confusing in others (e.g., fuel tank breather & pressure regulator).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason5driver View Post
And, I am not saying you need to replace ALL the hoses under the hood of your car.
All we're asking is WHICH vacuum hoses often need to be replaced?
And with what (since Realoem nominal prices are astronomical)?

It appears, from this thread, that only the smaller-diameter hoses are the ones most often in need of replacement, for example:
- Might we be able to list, with pics (realoem diagrams ok) of ALL E39 vacuum lines?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason5driver View Post
If you can't afford to buy vacuum hoses for this car (E39), then you bought the WRONG car, period.
C'mon now. Don't continue to be ridiculous. Nobody is saying they can't afford to buy the replacement hoses for their BMW. You are the only one intimating anyone is saying that.

What is being said is that we should, at the very least, know WHERE to LOOK for deteriorated vacuum hoses ... and, when the original hoses apparently don't last ... that we should replace them.

It also has been said that the original hoses, like so many things BMW, are of inferior materials ... so that, when we replace deteriorated hoses, we may as well replace them with commonly available (and vastly less expensive and decidedly better hoses).

The decided-better hose suggestions have been along the line of the NAPA orange silicone hoses, for example ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by mach.schnell View Post
Use NAPA orange silicone vacuum hose. This won't deteriorate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason5driver View Post
And, who actually gets prices/ price quotes from Real OEM????
C'mon. Don't make up drama that we don't need if we're to move forward.

I'm not a spring chicken when it comes to price & vendor searches. Every time I mentioned realoem prices, I said they were 'nominal'. If you don't know what nominal means, you have basic English issues that I can't really help you with.

When we're talking generically, it's OK to deal with nominal prices. The actual prices can be higher or lower than nominal - but - in my humble experience, I almost always see dealer prices of double and often triple nominal prices (admittedly at Silicon Valley prices where a half-million-dollar home is a POS with a postage-stamp lawn and about 1200 sq feet of living space with neighbors and barking dogs two feet away from your window).

In fact, in all my years of doing price surveys, I don't think I've ever seen a price LOWER than realoem nominal at my local Silicon Valley BMW dealer (Stevenscreek BMW of San Jose).

Of course, in places where a barely decent house isn't over a million dollars, I'm sure the far-from-here BMW dealers 'might' charge less than Realoem 'nominal' prices - but that isn't the point when you're dealing with discussions of what size, and material are best for E39 vacuum hoses. But we digress ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason5driver View Post
By trying to make-shift vacuum hoses for your car, you are going to end up with MORE vacuum leaks and problems IMO.
This is good advice. Since we first have to find the sum total of hoses to replace, that price will wait until we get a good list of all the hoses that 'could' deteriorate and cause vacuum leaks conditions.

So far, the list of hoses to check seems to be the following:

Engine => Vacuum control => AIR PUMP F VACUUM CONTROL
  • 04 VACUUM HOSE BLACK 3.3X1.8 11657803732 $16.43 (two pieces)
  • 03 VACUUM PIPE 1 11727574490 $27.94 (one piece)
  • 07 VACUUM HOSE BLACK 3.3X1.8 11657803732 $16.43 (two pieces)
  • 09 VACUUM CAP (no part number shown)
Engine => Exhaust manifold => EMISSION CONTROL-AIR PUMP
05 PRESSURE HOSE ASSY 1 11721435456 $22.73
Fuel Preparation System => Fuel Supply => Fuel filter, pressure regulator
  • 13 VACUUM HOSE BLACK 3,5X1,8 11727545323 $14.82
  • 11 Hose 1 13321437801 $24.87
Engine => Vacuum control => Vacuum control - engine
  • 02 Hose elbow 1 11617503666 $8.17
  • 03 Hose elbow 1 11617547582 $17.25
Fuel Preparation System => Fuel injection system => FUEL TANK BREATHER VALVE
  • 03 fuel tank breather line 1 13907557924 $27.77
  • 04 fuel tank breather line 1 13907504303 $27.77
Engine => Cylinder Head => Crankcase-Ventilation/oil separator
  • 02 Vent pipe 1 11611432559 $25.73
  • 03 Connecting line 1 11617504535 $33.87
  • 04 Vent hose 1 11157532649 $15.37
  • 06 VACUUM HOSE BLACK 3,5X1,8 ? 11727545323 $14.82 (not on all E39s)
  • 07 Return pipe 1 11617504536 $33.87
Of those above, these smaller hoses seem to be most problematic:
  • 04 VACUUM HOSE BLACK 3.3X1.8 11657803732 $16.43 (two pieces)
  • 07 VACUUM HOSE BLACK 3.3X1.8 11657803732 $16.43 (two pieces)
  • 09 VACUUM CAP (no part number shown)
  • 13 VACUUM HOSE BLACK 3,5X1,8 11727545323 $14.82
  • 06 VACUUM HOSE BLACK 3,5X1,8 ? 11727545323 $14.82 (not on all E39s)
And, these larger hoses are apparently problematic:
  • 02 Hose elbow 1 11617503666 $8.17
  • 03 Hose elbow 1 11617547582 $17.25
  • 02 Vent pipe 1 11611432559 $25.7303 Connecting line 1 11617504535 $33.87
  • 04 Vent hose 1 11157532649 $15.37
  • 07 Return pipe 1 11617504536 $33.87
Moving forward ...

Q: How would you (or anyone) modify this list of most important hoses to check for deterioration?

Last edited by bluebee; 10-16-2011 at 10:01 PM.
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  #29  
Old 10-16-2011, 10:26 PM
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BTW, a very weird hose-connection inconsistency has been identified here just now:
- E39 (1997 - 2003) > CCV vacuum hose important?

Notice that the ENDED part numbers only, match between the SAS & CCV system diagram; yet the NEW part numbers don't!

Quote:
Originally Posted by bluebee View Post
Trying to put the puzzle together, I notice what you're intimating by comparing ENDED part numbers between the two diagrams!
Comparing that to the other reputed side, the plot thickens:
Notice only the (color-coded) ENDED part numbers are redundant.

Q: What does this weirdly inconsistent information tell us?
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  #30  
Old 10-27-2011, 06:18 PM
Steve530 Steve530 is offline
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On my 2001 530i M54 that nipple on the CCV is capped. I have no idea why the diagram lists a hose there or where that hose would go.

My guess is that the CCV is made to fit both the M54 and an earlier engine that used that to supply vacuum to the CCV. I would also guess that specific vacuum hose was redundant and eliminated on the M54 engine.

The diagram for my engine vacuum control shows two caps on the back of the manifold. I don't know if both are actually capped. I felt one cap which is large, so I'd guess it is the 7mm cap 11611727176. The 3.5mm cap is listed as 11611437560.

I need to replace the smaller hose that comes from the "F" connector. Does anyone know where that hose connects to?
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  #31  
Old 10-27-2011, 08:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve530 View Post
I need to replace the smaller hose that comes from the "F" connector. Does anyone know where that hose connects to?
See this thread for more complete details:
- Correcting the F-connector errors in the realoem diagrams (1)

That small F-connector hose is #13 here which is about a foot (or so) long:


But, these Realoem diagrams STINK at showing you WHERE they actually connect!

The small hose connects from the F connector lower spout to a metal pipe which is secured on the wall just below the shock mounts (under the driver side air filter housing).

Here is my old small hose in place:


Here I am sizing the six feet of O'Reilly Auto Parts vacuum hose by connecting first to the metal pipe and then cutting to fit to the F connector:
- O'Reilly p/n P3340 $3.49 Thermoid Windshield Washer & Vacuum Tubing 5/32" x 6'


Here is the new hose from O'Reilly Auto Parts, now cut and in place on the F connector:


And, to give you a better idea of exactly what it looks like where it connects to the metal pipe, here is a closeup of the connection to item #10 vacuum pipe in the realoem diagram above.

Notice the metal vacuum pipe fits into a C-shaped metal bracket bolted to the side of the engine bay with and easy-to-lose removable rubber sleeve insert for vibration protection:

The reason the tip of the old small hose is frayed is because I was removing the hoses in the O'Reilly parking lot with the lousy screwdriver in the trunk toolkit to bring them inside for sizing.

Here are both hoses in situ on the F connector; notice they're just about the same length:

EDIT: The smaller-length broken hose in this picture is the SAP valve hose on the other side of the engine.
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Last edited by bluebee; 10-27-2011 at 10:07 PM. Reason: Added more clarifying pictures.
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  #32  
Old 10-27-2011, 08:57 PM
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Where is the SECOND endcap?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve530 View Post
The diagram for my engine vacuum control shows two caps on the back of the manifold.
Interesting. I only see one cap in my diagram which caps the port shown in post #9 above.
- Engine => Vacuum control => AIR PUMP F VACUUM CONTROL


Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve530 View Post
I felt one cap which is large, so I'd guess it is the 7mm cap 11611727176. The 3.5mm cap is listed as 11611437560.
I only replaced one endcap because that's all I could find; and even then, since the Realoem diagram doesn't show a size or part number, I don't know if the cap I put on is a cause for my slight vacuum leaks.


You clearly mention a SECOND endcap. What is the location of that second endcap?


Here is what the original endcap looks like, open end:


And here is what the closed end looks like on the original endcap:


It's important we find that second endcap you speak of.
Do you have a photo of it?

If it's in as bad a shape as my one endcap, I need to find it and replace it!
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Last edited by bluebee; 10-28-2011 at 12:19 AM.
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  #33  
Old 10-27-2011, 09:24 PM
Steve530 Steve530 is offline
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Thanks for the information about the lower hose. I could tell it went to a metal line that disappears into the abyss of the engine compartment. I just didn't know what was connected to the other end.

I got the numbers for the caps from the engine intake manifold diagram for my 2001 530i. I think they're the same for your car.

Next time I'm at the dealer, I'm going to pick up one of those "F" connectors. It's one of those parts that are prone to breaking and are only available at the dealer. And a clutch pivot pin, too.
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Last edited by Steve530; 10-27-2011 at 09:41 PM.
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  #34  
Old 10-27-2011, 11:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve530 View Post
Thanks for the information about the lower hose. I could tell it went to a metal line that disappears into the abyss of the engine compartment. I just didn't know what was connected to the other end..
Here is another thread showing where that F-connector small hose goes:
- Might we be able to list, with pics (realoem diagrams ok) of ALL E39 vacuum lines?

Once you recognize the parts, you can see the metal tube that the other end of the hose is still connected to has been slipped out of its c-shaped metal bracket (which is bolted to the metal body of the car):
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  #35  
Old 10-28-2011, 12:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve530 View Post
I got the numbers for the caps from the engine intake manifold diagram for my 2001 530i. I think they're the same for your car.
I just realized you're looking at a DIFFERENT diagram than what I'm looking at! And, that there are (apparently) THREE endcaps in that diagram (not two).

I didn't understand what you were saying until I did a part number search using the two part numbers you referenced above.

Here is the diagram I'm looking at (where only one endcap is shown and it doesn't have any description whatsoever):
- Engine => Vacuum control => AIR PUMP F VACUUM CONTROL

Here is the diagram YOU are looking at (which shows two endcaps & a description which describes THREE endcaps):
Engine => Intake manifold => Intake manifold system



It looks, to me, like the larger #17 on your diagram is the same endcap #9 on my diagram (and as shown below on my M54 engine):


So while your P/N information clarifies the sizes, there is the open question of where that THIRD endcap is located?

I'm not sure why they use a different size notation for endcaps (e.g., D=3,5MM) versus for the vacuum lines (e.g., 3,5x1,8 is 3.5mm ID & 1.8mm wall thickness) ... but here are the THREE endcaps I 'think' we need to buy (note the quantity = 2 for the smaller endcap):
  • #15, Cap, D=3,5MM, Qty=2, 11611437560, $3.39 (between 1/8" & 9/64" ID)
  • #17, Cap, D=7,0MM, Qty=1, 11611727176, $3.39 (between 17/64" & 19/32")
This size chart is from here:
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  #36  
Old 10-30-2011, 02:59 PM
Steve530 Steve530 is offline
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How about we put that second 3.5mm vacuum cap on the unused vacuum port of the CCV?
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  #37  
Old 10-30-2011, 03:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve530 View Post
How about we put that second 3.5mm vacuum cap on the unused vacuum port of the CCV?
Thanks Steve,

By the lack of response, I'm assuming very few people, if any, actually know where the problematic endcaps lie in the E39. Even so, we'll do the best we can with the limited information available.

Based on what we found in post #20 here, out of the two, three, or four endcaps reputed to be in the E39, here's the best I can do so far without additional help:
  • This diagram loosely intimates there is one capped vacuum port:
  • This diagram outright says there are three capped vacuum ports:
    • Engine => Intake manifold => Intake manifold system
    • #15, Cap, D=3,5MM, Qty=2, 11611437560, $3.39 (between 1/8" & 9/64" ID)
      • One of these is probably for the CCV valve vacuum port on the M54
      • The other 'may' be if the M54 does not have an air pump, then it would cap off that vacuum port in the back of the engine where #7 hose would go in the "Air pump F Vacuum Control" diagram.
    • #17, Cap, D=7,0MM, Qty=1, 11611727176, $3.39 (between 17/64" & 19/32")
      • This clearly is the rear vacuum port behind the sucking jet pump on my M54
Note: Searching found a vacuum endcap in the fuel system lines near the exhaust manifold; but that was in other forums and I haven't seen it here so it isn't described yet until someone gives us a better clue.
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  #38  
Old 10-30-2011, 04:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chisum View Post
Hi Blue

Take a sample of the hose you need to your local auto parts store they will sell you what you need. I think the vacuum hose you get at your local store is better then what BMW put on the car. Just my opinion.

Chisum
Yet another owner reported that method failed him just today.

The main problem with the "Autozone method" is that it pre-supposed the stores stock metric-sized tubing ... or even enough SAE-sized tubing to mix & match ... but, from my experience, and from that of others, they don't so that method fails, unfortunately...

Another key problem which will arise, is once you've removed the hose, now you're stuck (since it often has to be destroyed) without a source for a vacuum hose.

So, I think the 'bring it down to the store' idea qualifies as a 'bad idea'.

We need a better approach which includes being positive of the hose size, material, and availability.

EDIT: For the record, the best we can come up with (so far) for vacuum endcap location & sizes is the following:
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluebee View Post
Thanks Steve,

By the lack of response, I'm assuming very few people, if any, actually know where the problematic endcaps lie in the E39. Even so, we'll do the best we can with the limited information available.

Based on what we found in post #20 here, out of the two, three, or four endcaps reputed to be in the E39, here's the best I can do so far without additional help:
  • This diagram loosely intimates there is one capped vacuum port:
  • This diagram outright says there are three capped vacuum ports:
    • Engine => Intake manifold => Intake manifold system
    • #15, Cap, D=3,5MM, Qty=2, 11611437560, $3.39 (between 1/8" & 9/64" ID)
      • One of these is probably for the CCV valve vacuum port on the M54
      • The other 'may' be if the M54 does not have an air pump, then it would cap off that vacuum port in the back of the engine where #7 hose would go in the "Air pump F Vacuum Control" diagram.
    • #17, Cap, D=7,0MM, Qty=1, 11611727176, $3.39 (between 17/64" & 19/32")
      • This clearly is the rear vacuum port behind the sucking jet pump on my M54
Note: Searching found a vacuum endcap in the fuel system lines near the exhaust manifold; but that was in other forums and I haven't seen it here so it isn't described yet until someone gives us a better clue.

Last edited by bluebee; 10-30-2011 at 04:38 PM.
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  #39  
Old 11-02-2011, 12:01 AM
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bluebee bluebee is offline
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For the record, Steve is doing a test, for the team described over in this thread just now:
- Where to get M54 metric sized vacuum tubin at a decent price (or what American size)?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve530 View Post
...Viton tubing would last longer because it is unaffected by heat and oil.

I ordered and received 5' of the 5119K41 Viton tubing 1/8" ID, 1/4" OD 1/16" wall Shore 60A. It is about as flexible as silicone tubing. I replaced the piece of tubing from the SAP valve to the hard plastic pipe under the oxygen sensor connector. This tubing is a good tight fit for that application that is listed as 3.3mm. Maybe a little tight on the hard tubing, but that's probably good. It also fits well on the lower part of the "F" connector that goes to the FPR, which is listed as 3.5mm tubing.

Looks to me as though 1/8" tubing will work for both 3.3mm and 3.5mm if it is flexible enough.

I'll replace all the 3.3mm and 3.5mm tubing I can find with the Viton tubing and let you know how much tubing I used.
Given that new information, here is the current set of recommendations for E39 vacuum tubing:
Quote:
  • $7 ===> Norprene,61A (soft), -75F to +275F, PN: 51075K22, barbed fittings, 1/8" ID, 1/16" thick, $0.72/ft (minimum length = 10 feet)
  • $21 ==> Viton, Shore 60A (soft), -15F to +400F, PN: 5119K41, 1/8" ID, 1/16" thick, $4.19/ft, available length >= 3' = 5 feet)
  • $22 ==> Gum rubber, 45A (very soft), -70F to +180F, PN: 5543K41, barbed fittings, 1/8" ID, 1/8" thick, $2.21/ft (minimum length = 10 feet)
  • $55 ===> Viton, Shore 60A (soft), -15F to +400F, PN: 5119K48, barbed fittings, 1/8" ID, 1/8" thick, $11/ft, available length >= 3' = 5 feet)
  • Silicone,
PS: I've found out that one-piece tubing is not called 'hose' so my title of this thread is incorrect. I apologize.

Last edited by bluebee; 11-02-2011 at 12:02 AM.
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Old 11-02-2011, 08:16 PM
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Steve reported back to the team!

Here is a summary:
  1. 3 feet of 1/8" ID by 1/8" thick Viton tubing (Shore 60A) was idea; you don't want anything harder than Shore 60A and you can get away with only about six inches shorter in length.
  2. The BMW diagrams for his M54 were wrong on the thin plastic tube on the passenger side connected to the SAP valve and the electric valve; it's not straight; it's actually curved.
  3. Best to slice the old tubing longitudinally with a knife to remove.
Looks like we need a second source for that very thin & long vacuum pipe as the realoem prices are horrendous.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve530 View Post
I finished replacing the vacuum tubing between the SAP electric valve and the SAP Valve and the tubing between the lower nipple of the "F" connector and the hard tubing that goes to the FPR. That was all of the vacuum tubing I could find on the topside of my 2001 530i M54.

I used the 1/8" Viton ID tubing with 1/8" thick walls. It was a tight fit on the hard plastic tubes, but workable. I don't think you'd want anything stiffer unless it was just a little larger inside.

I started with 5 feet of tubing, and I had 2.5 feet of tubing left over. I also a short piece where I measured wrong.

It was difficult to remove the old tubing off. I had to cut it off the hard plastic tubing. I found it easiest to split the tubing with a knife and peel it off. The tubing going to the electric valve was hard to reach. You have to work blind. Also, I found that the hard plastic tubing that runs from the SAP valve along the valve cover was curved around the back. It was not two pieces of hard plastic tubing connected with flexible tubing as the diagram seems to show.

The old tubing was intact, but snapped when I tried to pull it off. It was functional, but deteriorating.
In addition, based on this thread, we've updated the locations of the evaporator purge valve vacuum hoses:
- E39 (1997 - 2003) > EVAP Purge Valve Flow


Last edited by bluebee; 11-26-2011 at 10:17 AM.
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  #41  
Old 11-26-2011, 07:34 AM
Bomb5 Bomb5 is offline
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Hi. I have been reading this forum since I bought my car (E39 530i, 2001) last summer. The information available on this forum is amazing! I will take my car to a local bmw service next week to get new CCV system, dipstick tube and intake boots replaced. They will also clean the throttle body and ICV. I just cleaned my MAF using CRC air sensor cleaner. I will do the vanos seals next summer.

I have tried to study the car as much as possible. I believe that I found the 3 end caps of my car using a flashlight and a telescope mirror. See the attachment. The largest (with a crack!) should be the part no. 17, and I believe that the two others right behind it are the part no. 15. I will replace these myself next week when I get the caps from the bmw service. In the photo I had already disconnected my DISA for inspection, if you wonder what the thread is. The DISA seemed to be ok after 120 000 km. However, it seems that I need to replace the valve cover gasket and spark plugs soon.
Attached Thumbnails
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Name:	M54B30_Vacuum_Caps.jpg
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Last edited by Bomb5; 11-26-2011 at 07:35 AM.
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  #42  
Old 11-26-2011, 10:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluebee View Post
Based on what we found in post #20 here, out of the two, three, or four endcaps reputed to be in the E39, here's the best I can do so far without additional help:
  • This diagram loosely intimates there is one capped vacuum port:
  • This diagram outright says there are three capped vacuum ports:
    • Engine => Intake manifold => Intake manifold system
    • #15, Cap, D=3,5MM, Qty=2, 11611437560, $3.39 (between 1/8" & 9/64" ID)
      • One of these is probably for the CCV valve vacuum port on the M54
      • The other 'may' be if the M54 does not have an air pump, then it would cap off that vacuum port in the back of the engine where #7 hose would go in the "Air pump F Vacuum Control" diagram.
    • #17, Cap, D=7,0MM, Qty=1, 11611727176, $3.39 (between 17/64" & 19/32")
      • This clearly is the rear vacuum port behind the sucking jet pump on my M54
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bomb5 View Post
I believe that I found the 3 end caps ... See the attachment.
Wow. Nice picture. Thanks for adding value! Much appreciated!

In addition, I absolutely love the way you brought the mirror into a closeup at the top left (I'll PM you to ask how you did that so well).

It's still hard to tell what is what, but take a look at my annotations below to see if I got them right. Let me know if they're wrong.


What confuses me is that the BMW diagram clearly lists 3 vacuum endcaps (2 small diameter caps & 1 large diameter cap); but the diagram itself shows only 1 (large diameter) endcap.

What you've shown is three (two small & tall, one short & fat) endcap, in keeping with the parts list - but - I'm confused because they're NOT shown on the diagram itself.

Do we have the annotation right in the photo?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bomb5 View Post
The DISA seemed to be ok after 120 000 km. However, it seems that I need to replace the valve cover gasket and spark plugs soon.
This may help for the spark plugs (most of the pictures are mine):
- One user's pictorial DIY for replacing the BMW M54 engine spark plugs (1)

These may help for the VCG (which I need to do myself):
- How to replace the V8 valve cover gasket (1) & for the I6 (1) (2) (3) (4) (5) & which VCG brand to buy (1) (2)

And, if you have your old DISA, we still need help in understanding how the vacuum ports work:
- How the DISA valve operates (0) & a BMW E39 DISA autopsy (1) (2)
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  #43  
Old 11-26-2011, 11:32 AM
Bomb5 Bomb5 is offline
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I am glad to be able to contribute in this case! I think the additions that you made to the figure are correct. Just by looking at the photo it seems quite obvious that these are the three caps. I will verify this later when I get the replacement caps and install them. Without the mirror, only the largest cap can be seen when looking from the direction of the MAF. Actually the large cap looked like it was ok until I took the mirror and saw it from behind! I will take a photo of the old removed caps also.
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  #44  
Old 11-26-2011, 02:39 PM
Steve530 Steve530 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bomb5 View Post
I am glad to be able to contribute in this case! I think the additions that you made to the figure are correct. Just by looking at the photo it seems quite obvious that these are the three caps. I will verify this later when I get the replacement caps and install them. Without the mirror, only the largest cap can be seen when looking from the direction of the MAF. Actually the large cap looked like it was ok until I took the mirror and saw it from behind! I will take a photo of the old removed caps also.
When you get a chance please verify that the third vacuum port on your M54 is capped.

On my 2001 530i M54, two of the three ports are capped. The third port has a hose attached that goes to the SAP one-way valve. Another hose runs from the one-way valve to the SAP electric valve which is attached to the SAP valve with a hose, a pipe, and another hose. This is the source of vacuum for the SAP valve.

I've attached a couple of photos that show the caps and hose.



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  #45  
Old 11-27-2011, 01:37 AM
Bomb5 Bomb5 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve530 View Post
When you get a chance please verify that the third vacuum port on your M54 is capped. On my 2001 530i M54, two of the three ports are capped. The third port has a hose attached that goes to the SAP one-way valve. Another hose runs from the one-way valve to the SAP electric valve which is attached to the SAP valve with a hose, a pipe, and another hose. This is the source of vacuum for the SAP valve.
Great that we have other photos as well. I will get the new caps in 1-2 weeks from now, and will replace them soon after. I will then report here whether there were 2 or 3 caps that had to be replaced but for now it seems that there are 3 caps. None of them look like a vacuum line going somewhere. I believe that for some reason, some cars have a cap and others have a vacuum line in the place of the 3rd cap. Could this have something to do with the country where the car was sold? My car was originally sold in Finland and the car should have the original cold weather CCV kit also.

Last edited by Bomb5; 11-27-2011 at 01:40 AM.
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  #46  
Old 11-27-2011, 07:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve530 View Post
On my 2001 530i M54, two of the three ports are capped. The third port has a hose attached that goes to the SAP one-way valve
Wow. First Bomb5's great pictures and then Steve530's fantastic pictures!

I, for one, much appreciate the annotated photos from both because I try to take pictures myself and realize how immensely difficult it is to get a clear shot of the back of the engine.

Steve even managed to get a shot of the SAP electrical one-way valve, which, to my knowledge, has never been done before (nor of the endcaps).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bomb5 View Post
Could this have something to do with the country where the car was sold? My car was originally sold in Finland and the car should have the original cold weather CCV kit also.
That makes sense. But it's not for the CCV valve.

In the M52, the vacuum source on the CCV went to the M52 fuel pressure regulator (while on the M54, the fuel pressure regulator vacuum source comes from the intake snorkel F connector).

Details here:
- Sorely needed clarification on how the M54 CCV vacuum port works on the M52 CCV valve connection to the fuel pressure regulator connection (1)

Would you kindly look on the Finnish BMW to see if it has a SAP valve in the front passenger side of the engine?

The SAP valve is shown as a closeup in post #1 and in the diagram in post #7 by Doru.

It's also discussed in these threads:
- SAP CLOGS or FREEZES (1): the secondary air pump (SAP) valve (aka diverter valve) clogs, taking out the SAS (1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7)

I think what Steve is suggesting (as shown in his combined photos below) is that you might not have an SAS (secondary air system, which consists of three major components, the air pump, the vacuum valve, and the electrical valve - all connected by vacuum tubing).


Last edited by bluebee; 11-27-2011 at 02:25 PM.
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  #47  
Old 11-27-2011, 08:10 AM
Steve530 Steve530 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluebee View Post
...Steve even managed to get a shot of the SAP electrical valve...
I don't think those photos show the electric valve. That black and white cylindrical device is the one-way valve. Note that the black side of the valve is attached to the intake manifold.

The photo below show the left side of the device that I believe is the SAP electrical valve. Since I cannot see the hoses going to the device I am not certain.

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  #48  
Old 11-27-2011, 08:35 AM
Steve530 Steve530 is offline
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The photo below shows the view of the hoses attached to the electric valve looking down from the back of the intake manifold.

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  #49  
Old 11-27-2011, 02:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve530 View Post
I don't think those photos show the electric valve.
Ah, yes. My mistake. I corrected it above:
Quote:
Steve even managed to get a shot of the SAP electrical one-way valve
BTW, your photos are phenomenal!

I don't think anyone has posted a picture in the few years I've been on this forum of the SAP electrical valve in situ before!
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Old 11-27-2011, 04:35 PM
Steve530 Steve530 is offline
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Thanks. I wanted to get a photo showing the SAP electric valve viewed from the firewall, but it's just too close for my phone camera to focus.
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